If you don't have RM1,000 in your pocket, forget it. It is an expensive subculture.

I think that seem to represent what the author and a commentator (Zarul) is trying to point out; the question about identity. Your last three words in the sentence above is very telling. The ingrained opinion that what seems Western are those, and what aren't are kolot, old and boring. I used to teach in an art college, and I had this jarring realisation that we do not have an identity. My kids in majority adopted many Western styles, which is lovely too, but there's something that I felt uncomfortable with when I reviewed their works.

The closest I could come to describe it is that, it makes sense for Western artists because this is their history… and I mean it in the sense that art style intertwines with their societal progress as they developed. But us? We have no root in *their* history. We follow things that has no root in OUR amazingly rich history and culture. Thus, it feels empty. (Granted, we're unlike Indonesia or Thailand or Japan who held onto their culture; ours tries to downplay our Hindu/Buddhist roots out of shame.) I hope I make sense… still trying to articulate my thoughts.

I don't think that the author hates such activities. While there's no problem with the hardworking folks in the video, we could try to strive in truly finding our own unique identity. Maybe that's her real message.

I'm actually glad that she wrote this article, we really need a thorough discussion on issues like representation, identity and cultural imperialism. As she said, KL is a state of mind – it's high time we critiqued this state of mind in order to figure out where Malaysia as a nation is heading towards, instead of merely celebrating or dismissing phenomena like hipsterdom.

one does not need to be a maker to be a thinking audience. and every audience deserves his or her own opinion. just because one audience's opinion differs from the other, doesn't mean that one of them has to make a video to state a point.

i'm all for a debate of contradicting ideas. but let's not stoop so low as to call the other to "go make your own if you're not happy with this one." that's like how ministers keep telling non-malays to "balik china" or "balik india" whenever unjust policies or actions are called to question.

meanwhile, Selamat Hari Raya.

I worked in the same company as one of the people featured in the video close to 10 years ago. That was way before the term "hipster" was used to describe everything non-conventional. It put a smile on my face to see that in the decade (well, close to a decade at least) that's past, his style hasn't changed a single bit. He hasn't tried to evolve into looking "the part", but he has stayed true to his roots – true to what he's comfortable with. Yet here you are, labeling a person that you do not know a hipster, a fraud, a Western worshiper?

Just cause he dresses differently from you, doesn't work the same kind of job as you or frolic in the same social circles as you, doesn't mean that he's any less Malaysian than you?

We universally agree that the video doesn't show the WHOLE story of what KL has to offer, but even you say that it isn't a documentary. So what's the point of this post? To call out a video that you dislike?

xinch has hit the nail on the head with these lines: "My wish is for a Malaysia that's inclusive, not exclusive. That's understanding and compassionate, not judgmental. That embraces, not shuns." and I hope that they mean – or will eventually grow to mean – something to you. Because if they don't, and your judgmental ways continue, then I truly do fear for the country that you look to shape.

On the other hand, what counts as 'authentically' or the 'essence' of KL seems like a moot question – by virtue of being a postcolonial nation-state, the so-called 'West' seems to be as integral to the identity of Malaysia as anything else (if we were fickle about tracing this, we'd end up subtracting a whole lot of stuff from 'Malaysian culture') ; could it be that the 'essence' of KL is precisely its non-essentiality, the invisible lack that structures any kind of postcolonial condition? To confront cultural imperialism, the question is not whether an outward sign originates from America, or China, or India, or wherever, but rather how one appropriates what is available in a context, and invest it with meaning that was not there before (e.g. Hainanese chicken chop). Postcoloniality, in the sense of moving away from inherited colonial mindsets, does not consist in subtraction (the eradication of the 'West' from our minds), but rather the distortion/appropriation of such terms as the 'West', in order to make us anew. One needs to dialecticize to move away from colonization, and not merely invert what is already there.

If everyone was to write the same way the articles will be just as dull as your 'constructive approach' argument.

Oh there's nothing original about Occupy Dataran, a midd-class-centric 'movement' which hardly represents anything other than some 15 kids buoyed by first world methodology and ideals :) If im not mistaken KL has some 8 million people living in it.

I can't help but noticing how sensitive the critics are. From their defence you can easily construe the class that they belong to. From what I see this class is often very opinionated and critical of things that do not identify with them. Like brats, they believe that their lifestyle should be immuned from criticism but at the same time they should be accorded the freedom to mock (often shallowly) others. Its easy to spot this class laughing at the stereotyping of the lower income group by stand up comedians like Harith Iskandar but when someone comes to mock them they cringe behind the convenient accusation of bigotry.

And you actually take some effort to step out of your comfort zone and bring yourself down to the ground a little you will find it ironic that this stereotyped lower income group, often chastised by the likes of you as conservative, can actually laugh and accept the stereotypes. They've learned to take things lightly and laugh at themselves.

So why don't you do the same? Don't you fancy yourselves as the more opened ones? I think the writer struck a raw nerve here. You may mock her for it but I don't think the author minds. I am very certain that she knows that the majority of KLites are with her :)

From the language of the author it is fair to surmise that she wrote it in the same spirit as south park. I think most of the rebuttals are off the mark, failing to address the central theme of her article – the identity crisis. If you read the article carefully you'll see that she never said what was portrayed was not KL. She merely said it is a simplified, unoriginal depiction of KL which is to me, in a nutshell, a melting pot of the east, west and the intrinsic . An invisible essence as she puts it in her response. I agree. To say KL is MERELY us going to Changkat to club, going to some hip coffee joint, designing clothes with no distinction from clothing in the west is just as shallow as the understanding of identity and culture most of the critics presented in their arguments here.

To me it would have been better for the director to interview what say a Malay Mgirl feels about clubbing in Changkat, what the designer felt about being an independent designer in KL and how is he any different from say a designer in Oslo or ask the owner how is her 'hip' coffee joint uniquely Malaysian. At least that would have opened viewers up to some in depth perspective of their endeavours.

These perspectives, molded by the dialectics of our conservative tradition and aspiration to break free and shape new values, will be uniquely ours. Culture is organic. To say it is as static and simplistic as the activities featured in the video is a misnomer. But still, it does not change the fact that the enterprises featured is unoriginal which was what the writer had tried to raise. Why do I say they are unauthentic? It goes without saying.

And much of the criticism also played on sentimentality. "Oh don't the writer know what passion they have". The author was not discussing this. She was merely pointing out the authenticity. Passion and originality are two different things. Lets say I may put so much passion and effort in being a hip hopper but does that mean the subculture comes from KL? I shouldn't even have to point this out.

Her critique is also one framed from the perspective of the class friction. I will say conclusively, without a shadow of a doubt, that those portrayed in the video are not the city's majority. So was it fair to depict KL only from the perspective of the minority? To do that is parochial. And not to mention the condescending tone of the director in describing the those featured as "unconventional and forward thinking people". Is the director saying that those with respect for his or her heritage cannot be progressive? Plus, how is opening a coffee joint unconventional? How is aping the mod culture fwd thinking? Does designing tees and clothes make one ideologically progressive? Herein exposes the imperialistic nature of this perspective: if you do anything that mirrors the white perspective of modernity you are considered as fwd thinking and unconventional. This is cultural imperialism 101. And, in truth, the activities featured in the video have already been established as mainstream for quite sometime. I wouldn't describe looking like the mannequins in Top Man or opening a bicycle shop 'unconventional'.

This goes to show the depth of her critics' understanding of authenticity. They can't even differentiate what is mainstream and what is not. This reminds me of the boom of grunge in the early 90s. The locals embracing them here thought they were unique not realising that they had learned of the subculture from MTV, the agent that helped raped and killed the scene and became one of the reasons behind Cobain's drive to suicide.

That was the underlying tone of her article. Put a little effort. Try and be more objective instead of giving emotional criticisms and the message of the article will easily be crystal clear.

Are there some nice hipsters? Of course there are, one my closest friends is an annoying little hipster but shes still my baby buddy. My point is, most hipsters constantly preach about the environment and social ills rather than letting the chips fall where they may. Thats what i call throwing it at your face.

Im not saying that I dont care for the environment, i recycle my plastic bags and all that jazz but i dont make people feel guilty bout buying polyester. You wanna ride bikes because it releases zero CO2, thats awesome but you dont have to stand on top of a hill and scream, "Im amazing guys! Im saving our fragile planet!"

Look, let me retract the statement, "lost respect for the common folk". It was uncalled for. However, I stand by my own opinion. No matter how much we choose to not admit hipsters are of the middle class, we know its true. Most hipsters are a forward thinking, articulate group whom are probably well traveled and versed. Since many hipsters are of a higher social class, many other social groups, especially from the lower classes are left out from this hipster society. Ostracism leads to disrespect and that is what i meant by "lost respect for the common folk".

If I wanna hang at the mall, why not? There are some pretty awesome places for me to get a beer. If I dont wanna go out, of course I'll watch the tele, the food channel is my favourite ( I LOVE CUPCAKE WARS!) I dont know how to play warcraft or diablo but hey, if I learnt to play it maybe I will like it. Who knows?

See hun, you guys do make people feel bad for wanting to do their own thing. So what if people like chilling at home or lepaking at the mall? It may be unproductive but in the end, it makes some people happy and there's nothing wrong with that.

I don't know about you but none of the above represents Malaysian culture. I dont want to bash hardworking Malaysians. I think working Malaysians from the checkout chick at Carrefour to the CEO of public listed companies are the very fabric of Malaysian society.

What irks me is when the new Malaysian hipster subculture throw their superiority in your face. They make the poor feel bad about not wearing their latest fashion designs but also make the rich feel guilty about buying expensive nike shoes that were made in Chinese sweat shops.

In MY opinion, the Malaysian hipster subculture does not represent anything remotely Malaysian. The fact is, they only represent one thing, themselves.

In my case, I am not a hipster but I am a Malaysian. How do i represent my country? I try to be good to people around me. I can't be nice all the time but i try. I try to pass on my Malaysian hospitality to others. Malaysian hipsters on the other hand, if you don't look like them, talk like them or think like them, you cant be them.

I try to pass on the Malaysian morals and ethics to my white friends so they would know how to act in front of elders. Malaysian hipsters on the other hand are so completely obsessed with the Westernized version of the world, they have lost all respect for the common folk.

I have complete admiration for young Malaysians who try to better themselves by starting small businesses. Its awesome. The thing is, they don't have to throw it in our faces.

To quote the response from Chris below: " Instead of debating the definition of subculture and hipsterism, the conversation would be of more value if we concentrated our efforts to uproot ideas and examples of what we each feel represents KL/Malaysian culture – something constructive that can move us beyond this debate"

The video may lack the "depth" some of you are looking for, but I don't think the video ever claimed to "represent" EVERYTHING that is KL. Rather, this right here seems to be THE point of Alive – to generate conversation and provide a platform for people to discuss and discover it.

Phang finally arrives at this destination by suggesting the Occupy Dataran kids, there is the Chair Project, countless philanthropy and social initiatives by amazing people that can be included in this conversation. Local business should not be exempt from this conversation either, as it plays a vital role in contributing to culture and giving back to Malaysian society.

Now imagine if the media were to take an equally constructive approach to their "critiques" and actually do some real reporting there would be some real value to them. Perhaps that's why the writer got fired: http://www.loyarburok.com/2012/08/13/lee-lian-kon…

The point of the video was to ignite conversation – I say mission accomplished, especially evident in our impassioned writting. We say KL deserves more, so let's stop arguing and see it!

To all, what makes Malaysia Alive?

Also… "In the Malaysian context, the closest we have in terms of an original subculture is probably the Mat Rempit, but of course they are vilified because they have bad PR, are not considered "cool" or "trendy", and are generally from the near poverty income bracket."

Also…. people don't like Mat Rempits not because of the bad PR they have. It is also not because they are not cool and not trendy or even from a near poverty income bracket. People vilify them because they endanger their own lives and the lives of those around them. That I believe is the reason they are vilified by those that do not like them and not any of the reasons you have stated above.

Also… I am 28.

I read your response and I must say that, if anything else, I am very much impressed by your vigor in having yourself heard over this ultimately trivial matter which I no doubt the pseudo-hipsters who voraciously defend the shallow video will think of as a "moral victory" for them because they have spoken out in defense of their brothers and sister in arms of hipsterism.

I find it quite a convenient ploy by the local pseudo-hipsters to feign ignorance on what is "hipster" in the first place. Of course, this ironic rejection of social labelling and a self-delusion that one is not "hipster" while enjoying the so-called hipster lifestyle is the paramount of the hipster culture anyway. At least you poseurs got this part right.

Again, I suppose most people who defend hipsterism (not you specifically, Ms. Pot) can't get over their self-indulgent, self-importance arrogant, hipster mindset to see what Ms. LLK (and a lot of people outside of this forum) are trying to say in their scathing critique.

You say that "the people featured in the video are Malaysians contributing to the economy and our creative scene. Who dare to go places that few Malaysians dare to, and who will hopefully inspire other young Malaysians to do what they love…". Well, they aren't the only ones contributing to the economy, you know? There are thousands of other individuals making changes and contributing yet don't get their due recognition because they aren't part of the hipster crowd. That's the problem with these hipsters. You think you open up a quaint little coffeeshop with your quaint little vintage typewriters as decor and you think you're something special. Meanwhile, there are hawkers in the roadside doing that for decades to eke out a living and they don't get highlighted because they are far from cool and they don't portray the superficial imagery hipsters worship so much.

A comment by Jack Hoi, biasedly extolling the virtues of his friends' efforts, while endearing, do nothing more than to distinctly show the groundless self-absorbed arrogance of the local pseudo-hipster "culture". He states that he is "visibly upset" and is probably crying in a corner somewhere and burning scented candles. He also says:

"Never Follow Suit is made up of 4 guys who are into fashion retail, and their funky boutique in Bangsar carries various labels, including locally designed and manufactured clothes, including Silas Liew's, who is making huge waves in the region and internationally for his fashion sensibilities, and thus making a good name for Malaysia…"

He goes on to say:

"Alang, the barista at Artisan, is spearheading coffee culture in our city. Irman at Grafa is doing the same for fixies. The Deer Society boys are adding spice and spontaneity to a very mundane and predictable clubbing scene. I could go on and on."

So? And? As if there aren't any other fashion designers who aren't making headway in the fashion scene. Of course they are, but since they aren't from his pretentious clique of hipster friends, he dismisses all other contributions outright. As if opening up a fixed gear bicycle shop is the most novel idea to have ever been thought up.

The main gripe in the whole pseudo-hipster counter-culture (if there ever was such a thing, at any rate it would be inevitable anyway) is that people are sick and tired of these small minority of self-absorbed clique claiming they're the only ones who contribute to anything, and then in the same breath being dismissive of of the more "mainstream" or less "happening" efforts. The "KL: It's Alive" video is a fine example of this.

So these local pseudo-hipsters should really expand your worldview. Stop boxing yourselves into the predictable stereotypes and then maybe you'll be less indignant when someone pulls you down from your pretentious high horse.

And you're not oversimplifying your perspective? What sort of argument is that? You're saying if someone criticizes hipsters they shouldn't live a modern life? Truly, it shows the depth of your perception of issues and the maturity of your rebuttal. How old are you, good sir? Nine?

Hipsters constantly pride themselves for being extremely anti or different and this idea is what hipsters use to make themselves feel special or important.

However, since the hipster culture has become so incredibly mainstream, self important hipster twats have to accept the reality, YOU PEOPLE ARE EXACTLY LIKE EACH OTHER.

YOU ARE NOT SPECIAL OR "COOL" ANYMORE BECAUSE BEING HIPSTER IS JUST AS EASY AS BUYING A TRIANGLE LOGO-ED T-SHIRTS AND DISCUSSING HOW THEY HATE THE MAINSTREAM ZOMBIES.

Sooner of later, all hipsters will realize this pseudo intellectual crap will lose it's charm because hey, everyone is capable of snapping pictures with instagram and sip chai lattes at so called "underground" coffee shops.

PS: Sorry to burst your hipster bubble but remember that "underground" coffee shop you love? Its listed on the yellow pages.

My major gripe however with your piece is with the manner at which it was written – you were dismissive of the whole thing from the outstart, your tone arrogant and spiteful and you showed a clear lack of balanced reporting and research. In the process you have belittled my friends and the people featured in the video as 'token', 'MTV', 'treehuggers', 'artificial' and fake, weak, unproud of their heritage and lacking of any soul.

You could have tried to meet some of these people to understand what they really are like and you could have tried to understand the contexts that the director has to work with. You mentioned that a good director needs to show the different sides to a story, in this case the struggle between keeping one's culture and globalization, you hinted at the complex issue of western cultural imperialism.

A good writer needs to do the same, one one hand there is the simplified depiction of KL in the video that was reduced to western-only notions, on the other, the very real, very passionate creative people that put their hearts into their labour and hold pride in their tradition and their origins. The fact that you completely forgot to argue for the latter meant that you have failed 'miserably' at your task.

In my previous post I took a neutral stance by not being overtly harsh and tried to see it from both points of view, in the best hope of you taking the time to dissect every argument presented. You seem to not get the point, and dismiss all the counter arguments presented to you without ever explaining. As they teach you in law school, where there is no substance, there is a need to pad it up with fluff. Let us try to dissect your counter couter-arguments.

"We are a product of this tension created by the bombardment of Western influences, induced by the postulated aspirations of the powers that be, while struggling to accept and redefine our original values. This tension is reflective of our perspective of things. KL is more than the bars, the hip coffee stores. It is a state of mind. "

You seem to love using really big words, which is definitely not pretentious. The video does not present that KL is only made of its bars and hip coffee stores, but presents that this is something that you can do here, merely an option. It does not say this is the only thing you can do here. It is completely absurd that you can consider coffee culture a hipster idea. Maybe you're too young to be brought up in the era of Friends who hung out all the time at Central Perk and not a Starbucks. So by your logic, this would make them hipsters. Our values differ from person to person. You are in no position to give it a definitive status. We are ever evolving as a society. A Malaysian society.

"The director, as an artist, has to find creative ways to depict this hidden essence. His failure to do this can be seen in the ill researched and oversimplified perspective. Do you mean to tell me the mere projected images of Malaysians doing Western-influenced activities is a well-researched effort?"

Your argument here is just to attack the director by condemning his lack of research and oversimplified perspective. I find it extremely ironic that you can't seem to see that all your arguments seem to clearly point out the exact flaws your article has. You did not research properly what hipster culture is, and just label it as westernisation. If you've ever been to any western country, you would know that they have their own hipster cultures which vastly varies from ours, and this is what I label an oversimplified perspective. As for Malaysians doing western-influenced activities, please do not let me see you eating Froyo, drinking Coca Cola, carrying any LV bags, shopping at Zara, or partying at Zouk. Please always only eat at mamaks/local restaurants, drink teh ais, use local brand bags (and no Charles and Keith is not Malaysian), only shop at Komtar and don't ever go clubbing anywhere, because that is a western influenced activity.

"And it's cute how everyone assumes I am advocating an Orientalist view of KL in my disagreement with the director's perspective. And for this, the response to this assumption shall be in typical hipster language: that debate is so last week."

I like how you speak of assumptions and at the same time make assumptions and judgments baselessly. You did not say you were advocating an Orientalist view, but many made that assumption of you, but in return, you also made assumptions about the video by saying its pro-americanisation and MTV-isation without understanding the hipster subculture of KL. You seem to really like saying things just to make yourself seem more intelligent than you really are. If I was the thesaurus that you repeatedly rape I would definitely make a police report. I'm pretty sure your right click on your mouse has been worn down by all that thesaurus abuse.

To paraphrase Lee Lian Kong, it is a tale told by a disgruntled law student with a baseless disdain for the hipsterism (which is very "hipster" in its essence), full of sound, with no foresight, and definitely signifying nothing.

As a writer/journalist, you are pretty ill-researched and oversimplified perspective yourself.

I'm very glad you finally got to providing some constructive feedback in your third to last paragraph and got beyond reminding us all of the definition of subculture. Because in all honesty, you raise a great point.

The frustrating part is that everyone is saying the same thing in a different way, that KL/Malaysia deserves more. You however, are a bit more grand as to how that should be represented.

The video may lack the "depth" you are looking for, but I don't think the video ever claimed to "represent" EVERYTHING that is KL. Rather, this right here seems to be THE point of Alive – to generate conversation and provide a platform for people to discuss and discover it.

Perhaps "cool" is not the best word to use to describe this, and perhaps they may not have used the bands/busineses/initiavtives you would have selected, but they had to start with what they know. Like it or not, the consumerist side of Malaysia exists and is effective in capturing the attention of the masses. (I will put aside the fact that you are looking at consumerism in KL as purely negative and not as an effective means to achieve sustainability, social responsibility and influence positive behavioral changes that many of the featured local businesses do promote.)

And BAM! Look what happened, 4 valid suggestions by you that now more people know about and that they may also get involved with. Now imagine if the media were to take an equally constructive approach to their "critiques" and actually do some reporting, there would be some real value to them.

I think the point of the video was to ignite conversation – I say mission accomplished, especially evident in your impassioned writting. You say KL deserves more, we agree, so let's stop arguing and see it!

To all, what makes Malaysia Alive?

But both you and maybe even the author make some very judgmental generalisations that seriously ticked off many hardworking Malaysians.

The idea that anyone would start a business or pursue an unpopular career (such as barrista-ing) for the sake of being "cool" and "making themselves relevant" is preposterous. Doesn't matter if it's a clothing store, designer label, tattoo parlour or coffee shop – they all take guts, blood, sweat and most importantly, a hell lot of love.

What I tried to say earlier, and what I feel most people who've "defended hipster culture" are saying that is that the people featured in the video are Malaysians contributing to the economy and our creative scene. Who dare to go places that few Malaysians dare to, and who will hopefully inspire other young Malaysians to do what they love.

They certainly don't deserve to be hated on.

Most importantly, most of these commenters who are "defending hipsterism" (or whatever hipster is anyway) have only made a judgment on the article, and haven't gone on an all out personal attack on the author for her opinion. Yet at least, But the author and yourself have judged so conveniently based on the clothes we wear, things we own and what we choose to do.

I think that says more about you both than it does about "hipsters".

Korang kat KL ni lak, lain le cerita. Pasal tu la gaduh giler. Sebab orang KL sendiri pun tak tau apa identity korang. Tu lah nak gaduh.

We are a product of this tension created by the bombardment of Western influences, induced by the postulated aspirations of the powers that be, while struggling to accept and redefine our original values. This tension is reflective of our perspective of things. KL is more than the bars, the hip coffee stores. It is a state of mind. 

The director, as an artist, has to find creative ways to depict this hidden essence. His failure to do this can be seen in the ill researched and oversimplified perspective. Do you mean to tell me the mere projected images of Malaysians doing Western-influenced activities is a well-researched effort?

And it's cute how everyone assumes I am advocating an Orientalist view of KL in my disagreement with the director's perspective. And for this, the response to this assumption shall be in typical hipster language: that debate is so last week.

As a Malaysian, you should understand the amount of censorship our creative industry has to endure. Whether it's a film or the Mak Yong or pocho-pocho, our government has done a lot to ensure that Malaysians don't become a society that can think critically.

Not to mention our budgets for the creative industries are always so skinny. We don't get enough support for the arts. These are reasons why we're not producing enough creative work.

This is why we're always importing cinema, art and music from other countries to meet the demand for arts and entertainment that our locals are not at liberty to supply. That's why we're influenced by external cultures, it's not cos we watch MTV. Hipsters don't even watch MTV. -_-

Besides, if you could sum up KL in 9 minutes, it wouldn't be a city worth going to then, huh? That's why the video calls for entries for people to show their side of the city.